Your world with Dr. Beatrice Hyppolite
Hello,
I am Dr. Marie Beatrice Hyppolite. I hold a doctorate in Health Science with emphasis on Global Health and master’s degree in social work. I have over 14 years of experience in the field of health and human services.
This podcast is primarily focused on mental health and the quality-of-life elements that affect it such as divorce, death, domestic violence, trauma, toxic relationships, and single parenthood to name a few. It is no secret that mental health challenges continue to profoundly impact modern society although not enough discussion is given due to stigma. Research has shown an increase of 25 % in mental health crises after COVID-19. It is important to have honest, uncomfortable conversations about mental health while being supportive. Although we are interdependent, change begins with the individual, hence “your world.”
I welcome you to join me on my journey and look forward to your responses.
Your world with Dr. Beatrice Hyppolite
Workplace Toxicity and Employee Mental Health
Discover the hidden costs of toxic workplaces with our special guest, Mr. Marc Bonhomme. This episode sheds light on the staggering statistic that 64% of employees face bullying at work, impacting their mental health long after they've left the job. Listen as we break down the various forms of workplace bullying, including verbal abuse and undermining behaviors, and explore how these toxic environments contribute to anxiety, depression, and PTSD. Learn why prioritizing personal well-being over job security is crucial when confronted with these challenging environments.
Mr. Bonhomme joins us to dissect the contributing factors to workplace toxicity, such as poor communication, power imbalances, and favoritism. Understand the domino effect of personal issues in professional settings and how antisocial behavior often becomes normalized. We tackle the often-misguided approach of collective punishment, advocating instead for individual accountability. We discuss how effective management and policy reinforcement can transform a toxic workplace into a healthy one.
This episode also emphasizes the importance of self-awareness and accountability in overcoming workplace negativity. Whether you're an employer or employee, introspection and daily self-check-ins can help mitigate the spread of negativity. We share practical advice and personal stories that highlight the need for work-life balance and supportive work environments that value employee autonomy. Finally, equip yourself with insights to identify warning signs of toxicity in potential job opportunities, empowering you to make choices that prioritize your mental and emotional health.
Hello everyone. I'm Dr Beatrice Ippolit and this is your World. Hello everyone, today it's a privilege to have with us one more time Mr Mark Bonhomme. Last time we had Mr Bonhomme, we spoke about co-occurring disorder, that's right. And everybody who watched or listened to the show also took a great pleasure doing so. And one more time I want to thank you for that opportunity you offered everybody to have at least the knowledge about co-occurring disorder, and today we're here to talk about a specific topic. Yes, we are what it is about.
Speaker 2:We are discussing workplace toxicity or toxic workplaces, and many of us have had experiences working in these kinds of environments, and if I were to give the short and simple definition of it, I would say it's any workplace where the environment is so bad that it's actually injurious to your mental health, to your overall health and well-being. So we're here to discuss that today and the prevalence of it and why it's a very serious problem.
Speaker 1:Okay, so what is the prevalence of workplace toxicity?
Speaker 2:Well, according to our stats, 64% of office of employees rather experience workplace bullying. For example, in a survey by the Workplace Bullying Institute found that nearly two thirds of employees experience bullying at work. Okay, now bullying doesn't necessarily have to come in the form of someone coming into your space and physically threatening you. How are the ways that bullying can manifest? In the forms of verbal abuse, someone talking to you disrespectfully? Passive, aggressive behavior can be a form of workplace bullying. There are many ways it can manifest.
Speaker 1:Can we also consider you know someone who's trying to diminish your work at all times?
Speaker 2:Absolutely, absolutely Undermining behaviors, even, for example, people not including you in emails or important communications.
Speaker 1:Exactly Okay.
Speaker 2:Someone who's taking credit for your accomplishments. This happens all the time, okay, and it can have a very destructive effect on one's mental health and wellbeing over time.
Speaker 2:And I also understand it's very costly, you know, to employers to really deal with the consequences of that behavior absolutely, because one thing that happens is, if you have an environment like that, where people don't feel safe, it's going to lead to a lot of people quitting in a very high turnover rate, and turnover is very, very expensive for an employer to manage. Okay, because you have to retrain people and you have to spend a lot of resources in order to do so.
Speaker 1:Yeah, one thing that I wanted to point out at the beginning both Mr Bono and I, we work for people, and today it's not about our workplace. We want to make sure that we let everybody know this doesn't have to do with our own experience at work, or what have you.
Speaker 2:This is just a general discussion.
Speaker 1:It's a general discussion that we want to, you know, just try to bring some light about it and show the correlation between a workplace toxicity and mental health.
Speaker 2:Absolutely, absolutely. We also have stats that basically indicate that the price of toxic workplaces is tremendous. Okay, we have a $223 billion annual cost. This was a study that was done by the Society for Human Resource Management and found that workplace bullying costs employers $223 billion annually, which is an insane amount.
Speaker 1:And does that include sexual harassment? Because we know workplace toxicity, you know like the sexual harassment component really costs employees a lot of money, absolutely a lot of money. I was waiting on the other day about, you know, a lawsuit where the agency had to set up for 250 million, you know for only for sexual harassment within the organization.
Speaker 1:So that's a lot of money absolutely so, while it is a lot of money, but those who have experienced sexual harassment, so it's also a lot on them, because nobody, nobody, no one should go to work to have any type of experience or or or what have you. So it's, it's. You know, you go to work and you have to experience that.
Speaker 2:Absolutely. No one should have to experience that Definitely not.
Speaker 2:So we do know that it's very expensive and on average it's about $16,000 per cost for each employee, and this was a study that was done by Harvard, a Harvard Business Review, and you know. So again, it's a very, very costly matter. So it isn't just a matter of people's physical health and mental health suffering, but this is also cutting into the bottom line for organizations and also a 25% decrease in revenue. So you're making even less money, because oftentimes what happens if you have employees that don't feel safe at the agency? That affects the company's relationship with its consumer, of course, right, so businesses lose money and, like you, are you talking about the stakeholder?
Speaker 2:absolutely yes. Workplace toxicity and mental health the consequences can be devastating, severe, long lasting consequences on employees. Mental health constants, exposure to stress and trauma can lead to a range of mental health issues, particularly anxiety and depression. Right, because if it's Sunday night and you're fearful of going to work Monday morning, okay, that's going to create a very dreadful feeling for you, and I remember reading somewhere where they said that most heart attacks occur sunday evening. Right, because people don't want to go in monday. They're afraid of what they're going to have to deal with.
Speaker 1:So very interesting, mr bono.
Speaker 2:Oh wow and then there and then, of course, there's depression, right? People may feel so out of it that they may not even want to go to work. So this impacts attendance, right? People going to take more days off than necessary because they just don't want to go in because the environment is so toxic.
Speaker 1:And you have also post-traumatic stress disorder.
Speaker 2:Absolutely. Because even if you, let's say, you leave that job right and you move on to a better or healthier work environment right, that trauma that you suffered you're going to still bring with you right and that could even impair how you engage individuals at your next job. Right, because you may feel very um, I guess not paranoid, but very suspicious or fearful of people around you after after going through that and how will you address substance abuse or use in that aspect?
Speaker 2:substance abuse is also an issue as well, and of course, that will impact attendance as well as performance right, because if people aren't happy, if they don't feel safe in their work environment, they may be likely to medicate themselves by using drugs.
Speaker 1:It is unfortunate, and I'm gonna briefly share an experience that I encountered once with somebody that I work with. I never knew that the person you you know was dealing with workplace toxicity and to come to realize one day I gave the person a ride and I smelled alcohol.
Speaker 2:On their breath.
Speaker 1:And I said what's going on? And the person walked into tears and I said to the person is this something you want to talk about? If you don't want to talk about it, I'll respect that. However, you're still going to need to address it. And the person you know two days later decided to break down all the hard time that was going on at work.
Speaker 2:And this person did share.
Speaker 1:And that person shared with me and myself. I could not contain my tears. I started crying as well, because I felt so bad for that person who had kids, who had a family and I said to the person it's not good. That's the time to consider, to do something, and I could not be more happier when I've heard that the person finally decided to quit the job.
Speaker 1:And they did find something better, I hope whatever that it is at this moment, I understand, before anyone comes in there to quit a job, you have to make sure you seek you another one because, at the end of the day, the bills are still there to taking care of. But there will be time where you cannot even focus on the bills. You have to focus, you know, first on your well-being, absolutely your well-being, your mental health, is the most important thing.
Speaker 1:If you got to a point where you know you have to consume alcohol almost every night, or before you even make it to work, you have to make sure that you are under the influence of something, then that's the moment for you to call out if it's so toxic to that point where you have to constantly medicate yourself, it's time to leave.
Speaker 2:Okay, it really is now. I would say in most situations, most toxic situations, it's, of course, wisest to secure another opportunity before you leave, right, but if there's a situation that's so bad to the point where, the minute you plant your foot into the office, you're already feeling sick, it's time to go. Let me just say that a toxic workplace is more likely to change you than you are to change it.
Speaker 1:So, at the end of the day, it's not worth your health, okay, your health is the most valuable thing that you have and you have to protect that at all costs exactly very important and I'm glad that you bring this up, and I read a quote by dr Christine Carter once and she said that you know the workplace toxicity. Not only it's dangerous for you, but it's the threat that pose to your well-being. That is the most important thing that you have to focus on, because at the end of the day, if you don't address that appropriately, you will lose your sanity.
Speaker 1:No one should wish to that level that level absolutely let's just, you know, read some of the cause and contributing factors to this number one communication, cultural issues. We have a power dynamic, we have privileges, we have systematic inequality that contribute to workplace toxicity. You walk in a place you have all the favoritism, racism, you know, and all the isms in the world, and you have people. Sometimes you know, while we mention, you know, like all those factors that contribute to workplace toxicity, but at the same talking, sometimes they experience or the situation may come from even the employees, because it's not at all time that everything has to come from your workplace. Sometimes people bring the toxicity into their workplace where other people have to experience it.
Speaker 2:Exactly, and so that brings me to my theory as to why it's so prevalent. I think that there are very big cultural factors that contribute to it. I think that we have a culture that celebrates antisocial behavior. We see it in the form of movies, music, okay. There's this attitude that somehow being rude or being abrasive is somehow cool or hip, and so people take these behaviors into professional environments.
Speaker 1:And I've seen people who come to work. Let's say, for example, you may have people who are in a supervisor position, right or management position, who love to be praised and love, attention you know, and you and as employees, you constantly have to cater to their ego, and if you don't do that, you may never see any growth in your professional career or even worse, you may deal with with a pushback because of it right.
Speaker 1:And that can create a lot of tension or pressure to somebody's life, which is not good. At the same time, you have people who may be dealing with whatever from outside and will bring it to their workplace. If I tell you that, I witness employees walk into fight at my job and I'm like what is going on? I thought that you know. So it's like you know people come to work just to work and even if you were dealing with some type of situation, I understand you know like you can bring that on the table and try to have a conversation with your supervisor or maybe some of the co-workers that you're comfortable talking to, but to basically block a fight, physical fight and the next day to have management folks to come instead of addressing the problem with the people who basically fought, right at the workplace.
Speaker 1:But they want to address the issue like if it's something that's you know as a general problem as a general problem, like if we all have, you know, something to do with it, so that, can you know, really frustrate somebody of course myself. I remember I experienced that and I nicely told my other person who was trying to have that meeting. What world did I play in that? So I feel that you're driving me into a madness that I don't have anything to do with right.
Speaker 2:so it's safe to conclude that a toxic workplace can often bring in innocent people who really have nothing to do with it.
Speaker 1:Exactly, people just want to mind their business and perform their job to the best of their ability. Exactly Right.
Speaker 2:But because maybe you have a few bad apples that are creating a hard, a difficult environment. The employer does not know how to address those individuals, yeah and instead just makes it a general thing and holds everyone accountable when there are only a few people engaging in the behavior.
Speaker 1:And now want to address it as a whole. And oftentimes, you know, when things like that happen, people feel that, hey, you know what? I feel that Peter is paying for Paul now.
Speaker 2:Exactly.
Speaker 1:And I don't want to deal with that. So if something happened, if Mr Bonhomme did something, you knew that was Mr Bonhomme who did it.
Speaker 2:You know, Mr Bonhomme would deal with the consequences.
Speaker 1:You know whatever consequences that Mr Bonhomme has to deal with, pull Mr Bonhomme and address that with Mr Bonhomme. But when you, kind of like, want to gather everybody and address what Mr Bonhomme did, I feel that you're not being fair to me. It's unfair and I do understand. I do understand it is important. After you address that with Mr Bonhomme, you can have a meeting with everybody to address or to enforce what the workplace policies are.
Speaker 2:Right, exactly. So, in other words, everyone shouldn't have to walk on eggshells or deal with the consequences of the behavior of just a few, right? So let's delve into risk factors of workplace toxicity, as well as mental health issues. Okay, one factor is lack of support, right. Inadequate support from management, hr or colleagues can exacerbate mental health issues. Okay, one one of the factors lack of support right. Inadequate support for management, hr, colleagues can exacerbate mental health issues, right. Okay, also, there's example. Another example is poor communication, right, ineffective communication, and I mentioned earlier bullying, harassment, gaslighting I think gaslighting is the worst. Right is when you have someone who's making you think that what you're experiencing is invalid yeah, or being too sensitive sometimes yes, overreacting yes, you may come and try to address this or that situation with me.
Speaker 1:You probably didn't have any bad intention. You just wanted to have a conversation about this. Right, and then somehow that person snaps and it becomes a full-blown confrontation. Exactly For no reason.
Speaker 2:Yes, so we have that. All these things gaslighting, as I said earlier, can contribute to mental health issues. Unrealistic expectations Okay. You may have a workplace where management is extremely demanding in terms of numbers right, and they may have you work extra hours and maybe even violate labor laws to achieve their goals right. And so, of course, that's going to weigh heavily on you because you're being expected to produce something that's beyond your ability.
Speaker 1:When you are forced to carry a heavy caseload or you are forced to do overtime, it's gonna take a toll on your body.
Speaker 2:I agree because, at the end of the day, I think that we should have work life balance. Okay, work-life balance is it's very important that when you're not on the clock, that you're doing things that you enjoy, that you're making good time of your downtime, so that, when you go to work, that you're doing things that you enjoy, that you're making good time of your downtime, so that, when you go to work, that you're feeling recharged and refreshed and you're able to perform at your best. Because if you're working so many hours to the point where you're not able to enjoy your personal time, then that's going to create a huge problem for you.
Speaker 1:Recently somebody told me about her experience because she was doing involuntary overtime after she worked like 17 to 18 hours straight and unfortunately she ended up in a serious car accident.
Speaker 2:Very sorry to hear.
Speaker 1:It was so unfortunate. I'm glad that she was able to make it out alive, because only God knows what could have happened. Thanks God, you know, she was able to pull through.
Speaker 2:Yes, well, I have a similar story. Actually, a relative of mine worked very closely with a good friend and, unfortunately, and they both worked in a very stressful work environment- my relative managed to move on and she found another opportunity, but sadly her friend was so sickened by that environment that she passed away.
Speaker 1:Oh wow, that is unfortunate. Yes, that is unfortunate because it's important. It's significant that employers, you know, try to better the workplace condition, absolutely, because if they do that, then they're the workplace condition.
Speaker 2:Absolutely, because if they do that, then they're going to have better output.
Speaker 1:You know I'm not asking you know anybody to just have that open door and have people come to work and do as they pleased.
Speaker 2:You see what I mean Of course, you need structure, you have to have rules, you need structure.
Speaker 1:The rules must be implemented. You know you have policies that need to be followed, so I respect all of that, but at the same, talking, know that, hey, as an employee, my life worth something that's right I may come to work, you know, to earn a living, but at the same, talking, I have a valuable life that's right, and the thing is is that if you were to pass away right, they'll replace you within two weeks.
Speaker 1:You say you say two weeks, mr Bonham, before even your path for my family member is already somebody like we don't make the funeral arrangement, so you know you will be replaced and there will be a long line, that's right.
Speaker 2:You know of people and this is why you know applying for that same job right, and this is why it's so important that you prioritize your health more than anything else yeah, it's very important.
Speaker 1:I know sometimes it's easier said than done. You know, to say hey. If you realize that it doesn't work for you anymore, just leave. Nevertheless, I also understand we have families to feed.
Speaker 2:Bills to pay.
Speaker 1:We have bills to pay, we have a zillion of things to take care of and we all are relying on that paycheck. But that paycheck not as much that it is important for us to earn it Wherever our lives is more important than any paycheck.
Speaker 2:I agree. So some of the other risk factors I wanted to continue were a lack of autonomy. Right, because micromanaging can be a very big problem, because if you don't feel trusted to do your job, that's going to add additional stress. Right, because you feel like your boss is monitoring your every move. I remember talking to a friend of mine and she was telling me that they actually measure her productivity based on the amount of keystrokes, because she works remotely, so they actually count the number of keystrokes as she's using the computer to measure her productivity. And I said to myself wow, that must be very nerve wracking because, heaven forbid, you do something personal on that computer or you're doing something that's not work related. Okay, they're going to weigh that in and probably penalize you and say well, what were you doing during that fraction of time in which you were typing something else? Right, something that wasn't work related. So I thought that was very interesting.
Speaker 1:You know, while you mentioned that, one thing that I sometimes normally don't understand. Let's say, mr bonhomme, I work here, right, and you're supposed to be the employer or the boss and we were supposed to have an event and all morning have an event, and all morning long we've been putting doing whatever that we were doing and there was no issue. And the minute that they say that, oh, mr Bonhomme is coming, now everybody is kind of like why he has to be that way, right, because I always tell people were you doing the writing? That's always been my question Were you doing the writing before Mr Bonhomme got into the workplace or the building?
Speaker 2:Yes.
Speaker 1:If I was doing the writing, then even if Mr Bonhomme decided to walk in, I'm going to continue to do whatever that I was doing.
Speaker 2:There was no need for me, no need to straighten up, because you're already straightened up.
Speaker 1:Exactly Right, just because Mr Bonhomme may have that sticky attitude that got everybody panicked. Exactly, and it's not good. I just me, on a personal level. I cannot deal with it, because I make sure that when I go to work I do my job. I don't need a boss behind me to dictate me every single minute or second what I have to do, but at the same time I have to know what my responsibilities are, absolutely what I'm getting paid for, right, what my responsibilities are.
Speaker 1:Absolutely what I'm getting paid for, right? So if my work entails that I do this and that when I come to work I must deliver, yes. But if you don't deliver the way that you're supposed to, because your work you know, so you have a one-hour lunch, so I understand you can have conversation, you can talk, but you have to work as well. While we're looking at the employers, I want us, as employees, to look at ourselves and see when I go to work, do I really do my job the way that I'm supposed to? Am I, you know, create a situation or environment for people to feel not comfortable? What role do I ever play into having somebody experiencing a bad day?
Speaker 2:That's right. How am I contributing or not contributing to that?
Speaker 1:Exactly.
Speaker 2:Yes, absolutely. So. I think that as not just as an employee, but as a person you need to think about what type of energy you're bringing to an office, right, what type of energy you're bringing to a workplace. What type of energy you're bringing to a workplace? Because there are people that are very unhappy with their jobs and because they're unhappy, it's almost like they want to spread that misery and infect everyone else with it. And I'm thinking to myself well, if you're that unhappy, then maybe you should find something else to do.
Speaker 2:Okay, but you have some people who are so unhappy that, no matter what job they're in, they're still going to show a negative attitude. Okay, so my thing is that if you don't feel happy wherever you are, then either you leave, find something else to do or get a therapist. You know, work with yourself, okay, but there are people who contribute to these toxic workplaces and have no idea they're doing it and they don't take accountability. They don't look at themselves, and that's important. We all should look at ourselves and see what are we bringing to that environment? Right? We're bringing healthy, kind, caring, positive energy, or we bringing negative energy?
Speaker 1:okay, so what would be your recommendation to employees and or employees? Dealing with that situation.
Speaker 2:Well, I would say, every day, people should check in with themselves. I mean, before you even leave the house, have a conversation with yourself, do daily affirmations, talk to yourself and tell yourself that you know that you're strong. Use these affirmations so that when you go into the workplace and when you go into the office that you're not affected by any of the toxicity. And one of the ways that you do that is by building up your psychic armor, and that means working with yourself, using daily affirmations, even prayer. If you are a person of faith, all these things can help.
Speaker 1:And you think that an employer should offer more support.
Speaker 2:Absolutely absolutely. An employer should show more support whenever they can Trust more in the employees Trust more in the employees Trust the employee can do his or her job right, because one of the things that I mentioned earlier was micromanaging. That's a personal peeve of mine, because you're being treated as if you're a child right, as if you're a helpless child, and nobody wants to feel that way. Okay. So yeah, trusting employees to do their job, offering them support when they need it right, and I think these things can contribute to a healthy work environment.
Speaker 1:If you were to lay out some positive impact for a good work environment, that would be I really like that question.
Speaker 2:Uh, of course you're going to have improved overall uh satisfaction from the workers, higher morale and, ultimately, greater output, which is what every business person wants. Okay, every organization wants to produce and make money right, and the way that's going to happen is if you have a work, a workforce that's satisfied with what they do, they feel they're being respected and they're all getting along. This way, people can be the most productive.
Speaker 1:Exactly, and it's very important. Your work environment is where you spend the most time.
Speaker 2:You spend half your life.
Speaker 1:You know eight hours of your time daily, half your life there. You know eight hours of your time daily, that's right.
Speaker 2:Half your life is spent working.
Speaker 1:That's a lot of time. So if I were to spend that much time in a work environment, you know, you want that to be quality, there must be some quality of life there.
Speaker 2:Absolutely.
Speaker 1:So I don't want it to be toxic. You know, I understand that, understand that, you know. Hey, I go to work, I don't want any favor.
Speaker 1:I'm not looking for favor right, but I'm special treatment no, I don't need that it's not no it's not important, because that's not the purpose of me going to work, but I want the environment to be safe. I want the environment to be compelling. I want the environment to be safe, I want the environment to be compelling, I want the environment to be joyful, exactly Because at the end of the day. So that's where I'm gonna spend eight hours, that's right. So I don't want those eight hours to be a time or a moment of misery. I don't want, each time that I see a supervisor or the person above my supervisor, for my heart to stop. You know, no, I don't know, because one of these days, so that heart may stop completely. That's right, you know. And I don't want to.
Speaker 1:Whenever that they say Mr Bonhomme is coming, no, but at the same time I must be doing what I'm supposed to do. So when you said Mr Bonhomme is in the building or Mr Bonhomme is coming, so I understand, mr Bonhomme may not be my friend, but I'll, you know. So hey, I'll see Mr Bonhomme and gohomme and great. Hey, mr bonhomme, how are you? The same way, mr bonhomme would say dr hippolyt, are you doing? But I don't need to like, oh, try to find something. There are people the minute that they say the director, the supervisor, the ceo or whomever is coming. Even if they didn't have anything of importance to do at that moment, they will create something because the boss cannot come and at this moment and see that you were not doing anything.
Speaker 2:That can happen that's right, absolutely so. Given that we've talked about uh, you know, toxic workplaces, um, I think one thing that's important is that if you intend to move on to the next opportunity, to the next job, it also would be wise for you to be on the lookout for potential signs of another situation, because you don't want to leave one toxic workplace and then wind up in another. So there's certain things, certain signifiers that you should be on the lookout for when you're interviewing for that next position. So if you go into, let's say, an interview for a prospective job and you look at the work environment and, first of all, it may not it looks very untidy, right? Or very disorganized. That could be a sign of a toxic workplace, right? Or if you look at the employees and you notice their body language, they seem very anxious or very uncomfortable or looking depressed okay, these are signs that the job might be toxic. Also, the turnover rate, right. If there are more employees leaving than joining, then that's a big red flag, right?
Speaker 1:And if they're willing to offer you the position right away, and it seems like they're really pressuring you that they're in a hurry, that's a big red flag.
Speaker 2:And if they're willing to offer you the position right away and it seems like they're really pressuring you that they're in a hurry, that's a sign of trouble. Okay.
Speaker 1:Not in all cases though.
Speaker 2:Yeah, but in many cases I mean like, if you, let's say you, if you have an unusual skill that they really need and they may need it right away, then that's different. But in a lot of cases it's because the turnover is very high and they don't have enough bodies to retain, so they keep trying to get more people to join, because more people are leaving than joining.
Speaker 1:Yeah, because by the time you hire somebody, the person will may only stay there for the probation time.
Speaker 2:Absolutely. And then they're gone and right after the probation time.
Speaker 1:They'll you know. They'll say you know what? It's not for me. I'm not saying yeah that's right so they're gone and you're constantly, you know, hiring new people for the same positions exactly, exactly.
Speaker 2:So these are some of the things to look out for in regards to any future uh, prospective jobs.
Speaker 1:Okay, my next question now, mr bono, what about if you were the issue?
Speaker 2:well, that's why I said earlier that's important for everybody to do some reflection, right?
Speaker 2:it's very important for every button to look at their own behavior. A lot of us don't. A lot of people don't have the ability to do that. They don't have the ability to actually hold up a mirror and say well, what am I doing? That's contributing to this environment, right? So if you're hearing from a lot of people the same complaint about, about your behavior, it's not them, it's you, okay. I mean, if one or two people have a problem with you and you know, maybe your personalities just don't mix, you're very different, that's fine and that happens sometimes. There's nothing wrong with that. But if there is a persistent complaint about you and it's the same behavior and everybody keeps saying the same thing about you, all those people can't be crazy. There's something that you're doing, okay, you're the common denominator.
Speaker 1:Yeah, I work with people prior. They'll come to work. They'll be very loud, they'll be at everybody's business. You know they want to spend. You know like. You know, like you know, three quarters of the day, you know talking about only God knows that's right.
Speaker 1:But will not do the job. But the minute that the supervisor come and try to kind of remind them why they came to work for you know, they'll get very upset. Exactly, I was born and raised in Haiti and when I came to this country I was already in my 30s. I walked back home, I had the privilege to be a radio host and I work as a secretary and as an account assistant. I used to be a city employee. I worked for both the national and the television station back home. I know about decency, I know about class, but one thing I've realized in many places that I work I have the privilege to work both as a professional and non-professional or what we call blue-collar job and non-professional, or what we call blue collar job. So I've seen the. I don't know if I can say the word. Can I say the word?
Speaker 2:Go ahead say it. Am I allowed to say the word? It's your show, say it.
Speaker 1:It's the gayness that people are bringing into their workplace.
Speaker 2:Right.
Speaker 1:So you, what do you think? Do you think, don't you think, that the gay owners can play a major role into having a workplace toxicity.
Speaker 2:Yeah, well, I was saying before that we have cultural issues right that contribute to toxic workplaces, because if you have a culture especially television, movies, music where it's telling you that it's okay and in fact cool for you to behave in an anti-social way, right then this is what's going to contribute to that. So a lot of people who bring that so-called ghetto, nissan ghetto behavior, getting it from the messages that they're getting from the media, because the media seems to encourage the behavior and makes it acceptable.
Speaker 1:And they think it's okay.
Speaker 2:Right.
Speaker 1:They always believe it's okay and they want employers or managers to go along with it Exactly. It's just not feasible.
Speaker 2:Right. So there are problems with the culture itself. Right, with pop culture in general, where people are adopting these ideas that unfortunately are not healthy. Okay, they're adopting these ideas and these behaviors, unfortunately have become normalized.
Speaker 1:I'm going to share that experience with you, where a supervisor, basically, was forced to send somebody home just because the person was not dressed appropriately.
Speaker 2:Do you care to explain or divulge as to what type of attire they were wearing?
Speaker 1:So the person basically had a really really tight, tight, tight pants on with a seat row.
Speaker 2:This was a female employee.
Speaker 1:A female employee with a seat loop blouse. Where you can you know the color of the brushes?
Speaker 2:everything.
Speaker 1:And plus there was some skin showing and the supervisor said you're not dressed to be in their office today. You have to go home. I hope you will have some more time to come back. If not, I'll see you tomorrow.
Speaker 2:So before this employee got offended, you know it.
Speaker 1:It was a whole scene, you know. You want, you want to make a call for you on the supervisor, who simply sent you back home to get dressed. You felt that that was not her role. I've seen why she was basically engaging in a vulgar conversation, you know using very it was really trivial, right, is that the? Yeah, it was very low. She gave me that look and I felt that she wanted me to engage and I said is there a dress code for the agency? So what the dress code says?
Speaker 2:Follow the code right.
Speaker 1:If there is a dress code and that's what she wants to follow. And I kept on walking. I don't know how the story ended, but because she was looking for my attention to say something. And she expected you to respond in agreement right, but that would have been one of her part, because I always resisted to go to work and that day I was dissent and I'm like. Those are behaviors that when you bring to the workplace, that's not something that I wanted to deal with on an early Monday.
Speaker 2:Exactly what?
Speaker 1:became of that worker? I don't want to go to details, Okay all right.
Speaker 2:I'm assuming it probably wasn't the best outcome, but maybe best for the work environment, though.
Speaker 1:But you know, it's to tell you that you know sometimes you know like you mentioned that we have to check on ourselves.
Speaker 2:Because the toxic work environment. We have to see what role we're playing.
Speaker 1:We have to see. You know, hey, what is coming from our employers and what are we bringing into the workplace as employees.
Speaker 2:That's right.
Speaker 1:He takes two to tango.
Speaker 2:Mr Bono Of course, of course, Absolutely. So it's very, very important to practice introspection right. Look at your own behavior, Be willing to hold up a mirror and ask yourself am I bringing something negative to this workplace?
Speaker 1:Exactly, exactly and like you said earlier.
Speaker 2:Take accountability.
Speaker 1:And, like you said earlier, you know, so you check yourself and if it is too much for you you got to work on it. Know when is the time to pack up and leave.
Speaker 2:That's right leave, that's right.
Speaker 1:I think that's the end of our show, so any last thoughts before we wrap up.
Speaker 2:That's pretty much it. I think, like I said before, make health the number one priority. Okay, the job is not worth it. All right, there's great jobs out there, but if you walk into an environment and you feel sickened by it, you feel like you can't function. It's time to go.
Speaker 1:Okay, Very important. Your mental health is the most important thing. If you walk in a place where you know you got to a point you have to drink, you cannot sleep at night, you have to engage into reckless behaviors like smoking, drinking or doing drugs, it's not good and if you feel that the pressure is too much, that you have to seek for professional health, go and see it. With that therapies, okay. Of that said, it's the end of our show and thank you for having me on doctor again.
Speaker 2:Again, it's a pleasure.
Speaker 1:It was a pleasure having you, as always, so I'm going to leave the audience with two books and one article. The first one is the Toxic Workplace by Gary Nami and Wood Nami. The second one is the Healthy Workplace how to improve the well-being of your employees. The last one is an article the toxic workplace by the New York Times. Once again, it was with you, dr Beatrice Ippolite, with your work.